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This is an introductory FAQ for alt.religion.druid.
A.r.d hived off of alt.pagan, alt.religion.wicca, etc. in the Fall of
1995.
It is for discussion about: Druids; Druidry/Druidism; Celtic cultures,
history, religion and spirituality. Note that some, who are interested
in Brehon Law and Druids as leaders of Celtic society, are only faintly
interested in Celtic spirituality; for others it's just the opposite.
I'm Elaine and I've followed a.r.d almost since it's inception. Because
I wrote this FAQ, it necessarily reflects my interests and biases.
However, my aim was neither to give my opinions, nor to give academic
definitions but rather to show the range of knowledge and opinion on
a.r.d.
Thanks to all those who post on a.r.d for their information, opinions and
websites. ...The FAQ grows slowly, it's getting long and hoary. Ignore
the blather and do something nice for the Earth everyday. YES! ....
The FAQ consists of twenty-seven questions. The topics being:
1 Info: websites, books? 2 Celts? 3 Celtic Languages? 4 Ancient Druids?
Modern Druids? 5 Human sacrifice?!! 6 21LoM - Wonder or fluff?
7 You are inauthentic! 8 Women Druids? 9 Becoming a Druid 10 Want to
see
more talk about practice! 11 Is Wicca Celtic? 12 Druids were
polytheistic?
13 Nature 14 Romans killed all Druids!? 15 Meso-Druids? 16 Ancient
Druid
Texts? 17 Druid feasts? 18 Religion or Philosophy? 19 Ogham? 20 Imbas?
21 Racism? 22 Deities? 23 Must Druidry = Celtic? 24 Fees for teaching?
25 A.r.d is a newsgroup. What ARE newsgroups? - I'm a member No, you're
not
26 A.r.d. Charter 27 Info on Netiquette so I can be a good usenet citizen
1 Where can I find information ? Websites, Newsgroups, Books
Websites for Druidic and Celtic Pagan Organizations: checked Mar. 21,
2008
http://druidry.org/
Order of Bards, Ovates and Druids - OBOD
http://www.geocities.com/mikerdna/index.html
Reformed Druids of North
America
http://www.adf.org/
Ar nDraoicht Fein - ADF Celtic and
Indo-European
http://www.Keltria.org/
Keltria - Druidism, Celtic Earth-based
religion
http://www.imbas.org/
Imbas, Celtic Reconstructionist
Pagan
http://www.britishdruidorder.co.uk/home.htm
British Druid Order - BDO
http://wildideas.net/cathbad
**Druidism Guide
(** This was the Druidism FAQ, but hasn't been posted for many years.)
http://www.summerlands.com/
Cyber Community - Celtic Pagan
http://technovate.org/
Nemeton and White Oak
http://www.euro-celts.org/
Concentrates on Europe, mostly auf deutsch
http://www.fainne.net/
An Fainne, Pagan group in Ireland
http://www.druidnetwork.org/
Druid groups, many links in
directory
http://www.neopagan.net/Contents.html
I. Bonewits, History of Druids
Websites with more of a Celtic cultural emphasis:
http://www.digitalmedievalist.com
Celtic Studies Resources, reading
lists
http://www.maryjones.us/
Celtic Encyclopedia, texts
http://www.ucc.ie/celt
U of Cork, Irish texts incl. trans.
http://www.siliconglen.com/celtfaq/contents.html
Craig Cockburn
s.c.celtic
http://www.siliconglen.com/Scotland
" "
soc.culture.scottish
http://homepage.tinet.ie/~kthomas
old Irish culture, Eolas na hEireann
http://www.isle-of-man.com
Isle of Man links
http://www.bretagne.com/
Breton Links
http://www.cornwall-calling.co.uk
Cornish Tourist Info
http://www.walesinfo.com/
Welsh regional info and pics
http://www.mojairlandia.pl/download/faq/welsh
soc.culture.welsh FAQ
http://www.celticleague.net/
The Celtic league aims to be a link
between the modern Celtic nations of: Alba, Breizh, Cymru,
Eire, Kernow and Mannin. It puts out a magazine Carn, which
has articles in all six of the languages.
Possibly related newsgroups, your interest may vary:
soc.culture.celtic, s.c.irish, s.c.scottish, s.c.welsh, s.c.breton
alt.spirituality.druid, alt.religion.asatru ( Norse, Germanic )
alt.religion.wicca, alt.pagan ( huge ), alt.magick, alt.mythology
soc.religion.paganism ( moderated to avoid spam ) s.r.asatru
rec.music.celtic
Books: chosen from recommendations by posters ( check year of pub. )
"The Celtic World" Miranda J. Green ISBN 0-415-05764-7
"The Ancient Celts" Barry Cunliffe ISBN 0-19-815010-5
"Celtic Heritage" Alwyn & Brinley Rees ISBN 0-500-27039-2
"The Celts" T.G.E. Powell ISBN 0500272781
"Pagan Celtic Britain" Anne Ross ISBN 0897334353
"Pagan Celtic Ireland" Barry Raftery ISBN 0-500-27983-7
"The Celts" Nora Chadwick out of print ?
"The Druids" Peter B. Ellis ISBN 0-8028-3798-0
"The Druids" Stuart Piggot ISBN 0-500-27363-4
"Ancient Irish Tales" Cross and Slover ISBN 0389202541 v. old
"Early Irish Myths and Sagas" J. Gantz ISBN 01400443975
"Celtic Myths and Legends" T.W. Rolleston ISBN 0-486-26507-2 v. old
"The Tain" trans. by T. Kinsella ISBN 0192810901
"The Mabinogi" trans. by P.K. Ford ISBN 050034147
"Celtic Mythology" Proinsias MacCana ISBN 0872262421
"The Druid Way" Philip Carr-Gomm ISBN 1-85230-365-4
"Encyclopedia of Celtic Wisdom" C + J Matthews ISBN 1852307862
"Druid Priestess" Emma Restall Orr ISBN 0007107692
2 Who are were the Celts ?
This is can be touchy topic and there are many definitions.
- A culture and people defined by the archeological remains of two
cultures
now in Austria and Switzerland: Halstatt ( 800BC to 250BC ) and La Tene
( +/- 430BC to 1AD ). The Celts, whose language group belongs to the
Indo-European family of languages, eventually influenced lands from
Turkey
to Spain to the British Isles. Names of a few of the tribes were:
Arverni,
Treveri, Helvetii, Venetes, Silures, Caledonii. Most were conquered by
the Romans by 200AD. Remnant peoples in Ireland, Scotland and Wales
converted/were converted to Christianity by +/- 700AD.
( N.B. This definition excludes the pre-Celtic Neolithic peoples, who
built stone monuments, such as StoneHenge and New Grange. )
- The peoples living in the modern Celtic "nations" of: Brittany,
Cornwall,
Ireland, Mann, Scotland and Wales. While united in pre-history, they
have differances in language, history and culture.
( N.B. The Welsh and Scots get really annoyed if you
equate "Celtic" solely with "Irish". )
- Anyone, living or dead, in an area, ever occupied by the Ancient Celts.
- Anyone, anywhere with a drop of Celtic blood in their ancestry.
Opinion bits as such appear:
"The Celts as a people were extinct by 400AD and that's that!"
"'Celtic' describes a linguistic group and nothing else!"
"Celtic is an ethos. Anyone can be a Celt, if they really feel it!"
3 How do you say ... in Celtic ?
Dumb question, unfortunately, because there is no one Celtic language.
Ask rather about: Breton ( Brezhoneg ), Cornish ( Kernowek ), Irish
( Gaeilge ), Scots Gaelic* ( Gaidhlig ), Manx Gaelic ( Gaelg ), or
Welsh ( Cymraeg ). You might also post such a request to one of the
related soc.culture groups. There have been occasional naughty
mis-translations.
The modern Celtic languages are in two groups:
Q-Celtic, Goidelic - Irish, Scottish and Manx Gaelic - derived from Old
Irish
P-Celtic, Brythonic - Breton, Cornish and Welsh - derived from Old Welsh
* Note: Don't confuse with "Scots" a germanic language related to
English.
4 Who were the Druids ? Now, who are Druids? Are there different Types?
They were religious and social leaders of the continental Celts,
e.g. the Gauls, as described by the Greeks and Romans. The Romans
later used the same term for leaders of the Britons. It's not certain
if all Celtic cultures used a word similar to "druid" or if their social
structures were the same. General attributes assigned to Druids:
they passed their teachings along orally, not by writings; becoming a
Druid required a long period of study; they were excused from military
service but could enter battle if they chose; they were members of an
elite class which included various occupations.
Today the term is used variously, with some opinion that it shouldn't
be used at all because the ancient Celts no longer exist. Currently
people using the term "Druid" can be:
- Members of a modern Druid organization, some of whom will only
call themselves Druids after a period of study.
- Solitary Druids who studied on their own or with others
- Self-recognized "traditional" Druids, who claim to have received
the knowledge in a family descended from Druids but who won't
describe their beliefs much as they must be taught face to face.
- Celtic Wiccans
- Someone who is interested in Druids
- Role playing gamers or some historical recreationists
( generally, on a.r.d., the last three would not be approved usages )
It is a little hard to categorize the Druid organizations as they tend
to overlap in interests and attitude. They were all founded fairly
recently, although some were founded by members of previous Druid
organizations. They have been influenced by similar cultural threads.
Even nationalist influences have been reduced by migration and the
Internet. The following are some broad categories, maybe stereotypes,
of types found in Druid groups. When things are going well, their
members discuss their common interests politely on a.r.d.
-Traditional or organized Traditional - These derive from folk history in
the British Isles and from the Celtic Renaissance/Revival of the
eighteenth
and ninetenth centuries. They consider that they come from an unbroken
line. The European ones have the benefit of living near modern Celtic
communities and/or historical Celtic and Neolithic sites. Others complain
that their traditions are the result of nineteenth century invention and
occultism; that they are more a Christian offshoot than descendants of the
Druids. Celtic historicists accuse them of being fluffy bunnies.
-Neo-Pagan Druids - This group concedes that they're not sure what the
Ancient Druids did but they want to create/recreate a modern version.
They study the ancient Celts and Neo-lithic peoples throughout Europe
and also modern interests such as psychology and comparative religion.
They are seriously trying to establish a religion. Some others,
especially British Traditionalists, accuse them of being fluffy bunnies.
-Historically Accurate Druids - They limit their research to Celts only.
If, there's no text or no archaeological site to back up an idea, they
won't consider it. They may be disdainful of modern society and want
to recreate something better. Some seem to express little spirituality
or sense of humor. They would eat fluffy bunnies, if properly roasted
on a historically accurate Celtic hearth, but, fear it might give them
indigestion.
-Eclectic verging on New-Age - They trip through dewey pastures seeking
influences from the world round. Choices of ritual or myth are made on
an intuitive basis: does it feel right, not, is it related to reality.
Some are making serious attempts. Others would be if they could just
find the right necklace to match their cape. Some are out and out
fluffy bunnies and are loving every minute.
-Political Druids - May know a fair amount about ancient Druids and
Celts but think a contem****ary Druids emphasis should be on current
life. If you don't protest and comment at length about issues, such
as the war in Iraq, they will consider you to be an irrelevant
fluffy bunny. A possible sub-group are the ones who belabor any
discussion of Celtic history and culture as being "bookish". Things
must be up-to-date, learned face-to-face, in the flesh. An opinion
which makes their presence on a text-based newsgroup somewhat curious.
5 How can you be interested in Druids when they sacrificed humans !!?
The Romans sacrificed prisoners of war to their Gods but nobody expects
to see human sacrifice in Rome today. This question seems to fascinate.
Did Ancient Celts practice human sacrifice ? The answer is: yes and no.
Some seem to be certain that the answer is a firm "no" and, moreover,
that Druids were non-violent. Given the references to fighting prowess
by the Romans and Greeks and all the warrior imagery in the old Irish
texts, this seems unlikely to me. The existance of spectacular
Wicker Man type sacrifices also seems unlikely, given the only source is
Roman military texts.
The Greeks and Romans had practiced human sacrifice sometimes during their
histories so it wouldn't be all that surprising if the Celts also did.
>From what I've read, the Celts took body parts as trophys during war and
they most likely executed prisoners of war and criminals. However, we
don't know if these acts had religious connotations for them, because
Druids of that era didn't believe in writing down their beliefs and
practices. Some are sure that the strangled "Bog Men" prove at least
small scale human sacrifice. But reading the difference between
"execution" and "sacrifice" in archaeological remains is difficult.
If the topic interests you, read up on it yourself.
6 Isn't the "Twenty One Lessons of Merlyn" marvelous !
A flamebait question, if ever there was one. Approach carefully.
I've never read the 21LoM. It is, evidently, a work of fiction,
that some admire but which contains a lot of misinformation.
Those charitable toward it, say that it's a pleasant work of
storytelling that inspired them at the time, even if they now
realize that a lot of the details are wrong, sometimes laughably so.
Those, who think it's harmful because it spreads lies about Celtic
culture, loathe it so much that they practically foam at the mouth.
Some webpages contain files devoted to pointing out a few errors.
See: http://www.digitalmedievalist.com/faqs/pheryllt.html
http://www.maryjones.us/jce/21lessons.html
http://www.cyberwitch.com/wychwood/Library/whenIsACeltNotACelt.htm
7 Why is Druid group #### so inauthentic ?
Yeah, well, they probably think you're inauthentic so be polite !
( Or, in my case, try to be polite. I do try. )
8 Were there women Druids ?
No. Yes, of course! Yes. Well, maybe a few exceptional ones but...
A very, small minority of those posting to a.r.d. think that leading
Celtic religion is *** linked. Some think that Druids were men and
somewhat military, that the healing was done by women who were witches.
This idea is more common among some Celtic Wiccans.
Many think that not only did the Ancient Druids have women Druids but
they had an egalitarian society.
Others, more historically inclined, will point out that whereas the Celts
allowed their woman more freedom than the other cultures of the era, it
was hardly equality as we know it. But there certainly were women druids
then and there certainly are now, two thousand years later.
Well...say some others, the position of women leaders is not adequately
defined in the Roman texts. There were women military leaders, such as
Boudicca, but do we know that they were fully accepted as druids ? They
can't have been common. etc. etc.
9 How do you become a Druid ?
There is no one authority on Druids so no-one agrees. You can simply
declare yourself a druid. Not everyone will agree with you but it's been
done before.
The ancient Druids had to study a long time - twelve, twenty years and
were
the leaders of their people. Not every Celt was considered a Druid.
Those
following this model, think you have to study a long time and be
acknowledged
by other Druids, before you call yourself a Druid. You'd have to study
Celtic history, culture, language and spirituality and maybe demonstrate
a special gift such as insight or leader****p skills. Some of those, who
follow this model, only believe in teaching face to face so, if you ask
on a.r.d about becoming a druid, you may get silence or cryptic answers.
Several of the Druid groups have descriptions of the qualifications for
Druids, some offer lessons or correspondance courses. You can do the
course
and, in some cases, be considered a Druid by that group. It may be a
simple
reading list, others evidently require that you mail in essays etc. I
think
OBOD's course ends up requiring three to six years of study.
Many figure that if they are interested in the practice of
Druidism/Druidry
then they are Druids. The assumption is that anyone interested in "Celtic
religion" or "Nature religon" is automatically a Druid. Some add
qualifiers
such as: neo-pagan, neo-, solitary, ecclectic, true, nature, etc. Others
name themselves Druids but only do so after some consideration and study.
10 Why isn't there more talk around here about actual Druid practices ?
One reason, is that newsgroups are entirely public. Someone may not mind
their boss knowing about their interest in Druids and history but might
fear
getting fired for being religious "wierdos" if any practices were
mentioned.
Another reason is that some ( but not all ) think rituals should be secret
and therefore do not belong on newsgroups.
List-servs, mailing lists and websites may be better places for that sort
of
topic. On the other hand, there have been good threads on what people do
and believe. The best way to get talk going on a topic, is to post on it
yourself. This usually works better than a simple question.
11 Isn't Wicca Celtic ?
Check on a Wiccan site for a definition of Wicca. Generally, around here,
Wicca is considered to be a modern, neo-pagan religion, with myths and
practices derived from many sources. Some of those sources are Celtic but
it's usually quite in the minority. Celtic Wiccans try to stick to Celtic
sources but still, their core beliefs were handed down from Gerald Gardner
and he wasn't trying to be Celtic. Many Celtic Wiccans are excellant
scholars but not all are. A lot of things reputed to be Celtic are not.
see: http://www.clannada.org/wicca.php
( wordy but worthy, skim )
12 Are Druids polytheists or pantheists ? Monotheists ?
The ancient Celts seem to have been polytheists. There are many gods and
goddesses identified with the Celts. After the Gauls, Belgae and Britons
were conquered by the Romans, there were hybrid forms. Or, at least,
there
were inscriptions pairing the names of a Roman god and a Celtic god. When
the Irish adapted Christianity, the idea of a monotheist father god plus
son and saints, seems to have fit into a Druid framework fairly easily, at
least initially.
There have been on a.r.d.: polytheists, dualists, monotheists, pantheists
atheists and nature wor****ppers. Also the type of belief varies e.g.:
are the gods real or are they metaphors?; is faith authoritative or
individual?, etc. This can be a very sensitive subject. Agnostic types
and
true believer types can hurt each other's feelings without even meaning
to.
13 Is Nature im****tant to Druids ?
- "It's everything to Druids."
- "Of course it was im****tant to Druids, they lived in the forest
but let's discuss something more interesting."
While people in many parts of the third world are intimately dependant
on nature for their survival, few of us are. The Celts had to read the
seasons so they could plant their crops; had to know where to find wild
plants if the crops failed; had to know birds and their habits for
divination; had to know which tree produced good wood for spears or
yokes or buckets; had to know the habits of animals for hunting and
fi****ng; had to know the earth so they could find ores for their tools
and weapons and jewelery.
Some figure, that the modern Druid should know a lot about nature and
spend
time in the Wild, that nature ( or Nature ) is the true focus of Druidism.
Some figure that a well educated adult should know a fair amount of
science
including environmental studies but, since most people now live in cities,
the focus of Druidic studies and discussion should be history and ethics.
Some wor****p Nature. Some romanticize Nature. Some live in nature.
Some mine it as a source for symbols. Some abstract it and assign
it a place in their philosophy.
Nature definitely pops up in discussion.
14 Didn't the Romans kill all the Druids?
How can there be real Druids today when the Christians killed them all?
The Romans conquered, and in some cases colonised, Celtic peoples over
a period of several hundred years. Some areas, Ireland and most of
Scotland, were never entered by Roman armies. Other areas, like Wales and
some of the areas now in Germany, were nominally conquered but never
consolidated or ruled on a day to day basis. As was common in warfare
of the day, the Romans sometimes killed large numbers of the people they
conquered: Druids and commoners; men, women and children. It served as
a warning to neighbouring tribes not to resist Roman might.
There is frequent reference, by some, to a Roman text by Tacitus about a
battle in Anglesey, Wales. The idea is that Anglesey was a headquarters
of Druids, that many Druids were killed, so that this put an end to the
power of the Druids. Countering this are those who say: that Tacitus is
misquoted; Anglesey didn't seem im****tant and that there were Druids
mentioned in Roman texts after this time. Also, other than treaties
and trade, there's no evidence for the Celts having many inter-tribal
structures, except perhaps in Gaul under Roman rule. So it is very
unlikely that Druids in Ireland, Scotland, etc. would have stopped
existing due to Roman activities in other countries.
Around the time Romans were conquering Britain, they were also persecuting
Roman Christians. The Roman empire didn't become Christian until the
time of Constantine, which was after most of the wars against the Celts.
Roman pagans conquered Celtic pagans. But being polytheists, discovering
new local dieties didn't bother the Romans. There are many examples of
statues of dieties with both Roman and Celtic inscriptions. It seems that
the Romans didn't object to conquered peoples continuing their own
religions, as long as they didn't cause trouble and put up a statue of
the Emperor, who had come to be considered divine. The Christians, being
monotheists, refused to wor****p the Emperor and so were persecuted.
Incidently, the Irish pagans converted quite peacefully to Christianity
beginning in the fourth century. There were no wars. Initially, however
it was quite a hybrid form where Druids and filidh seemed to have retained
some power. It has been arued that, in some eras, Christianity was
strongly
influenced by Celtic thought.
Finding Celtic/Druidic cultural elements devoid of Roman or Christian
influence is a constant topic and frequently provokes arguments. There
is little argeement about which sources are pure enough. Our knowledge
of the Celts is felt to be contaminated variously by: Romans, Christians,
European Empires, bad academics, all academe, lack of intuitive insight,
romanticism, time, wishful thinking, racism and global cor****ations. ;)
15 What are Meso-Druids?
In the 1800's, 1900's there were fraternal organisations called Druids.
These organisations were modelled on the Masons, some of the first of
these "Druids" were also Masons. They were a response to the Celtic
Revival; Celtic things were cool and a little naughty. In their own
mythology, they did have a link to Druids of old but this is hard to see.
They remained Christian in thought and considered Druidry a philosophy.
Whereas there were probably some esoteric rituals and thoughts on
spirituality or philosophy, they knew little about ancient Druids or
Celtic culture. Much of their Celtica was invented not researched.
However, this often fanciful interest in Druids did encourage legitimate
study of the Celts, a field that had been neglected in favour of the
Romans. Years later OBOD was founded by some former Meso-Druids and it
now has a more neo-pagan and Celtic outlook. AODA is an American
version of a meso to neo group.
for more on this subject see: http://www.neopagan.net/MesoDruids.html
16 Are there any surviving ancient texts that refer to the Celts?
Yes and no.
Yes, there are Roman, Irish and Welsh texts that are very im****tant
because they give us im****tant details about the life and history of
the Celts and enable us to interpret and date archaeological findings.
Even some of the early Breton and Irish manuscripts on the lives of the
Saints, such as the Life of Colmcille, contain observations of Celtic
society, although some would dismiss all Christian texts as contaminated.
No, because, other than some Roman, Gaulish and Irish stone carvings,
no original texts survive. What we have are copies, partial copies and
quotes. The copiers were Christian monks.* Some assume that the monks
cleaned up and Christianized the texts. This did happen with some texts.
Others say, well...the monks were pretty conservative about texts, they
usually just copied them. Even when the Vatican burned books, it often
preserved one copy. Nonetheless some feel that only archaeological
sources are trustworthy for information on the Celts, not texts.
(* also some Arabic copies I believe )
Roman Texts - These were written over about eight hundred years by people
who conquered and colonised the Celts. They were enemies of the Celts
and some of the texts might be considered military propaganda. On the
other hand, some Celtic tribes were allies and comrades-in-arms with the
Romans. The Celtic lands became part of the empire and some Celts were
Roman citizens. If many of the writers were never personally in Celtic
lands, others were careful observers according to the standards of the
era. Some later rulers and authors were Celts.
This is just an arbitary top ten list of Roman authors. For a longer
list with verses sited see "The Ancient Celts", Cunliffe p288. Given
the multicultural nature of the empire, some authors (*) were Greek or
wrote in Greek.
Polybius* c204-122BC; Poseidonius c135-50BC not Roman, known through
frequently uncredited quotes by later authors; Julius Caesar 100-44BC
a military leader and dictator, traveled in Celtic lands including
southern Britain; Strabo* c64BC-AD21; Livy 59BC-AD17; Lucan AD39-65
wrote a poem which includes a lurid description of Druid sacrificial
grove; Pliny AD23-79; Tacitus cAD55-120 mentions the battle with the
Druids at Anglesey; Dio Cassius AD155-230+ describes Boudicca;
Ammianus Marcellinus cAD330-395 describes Gaulish women fighting.
Irish Texts - The earliest extant Irish texts have Christian content;
the bible, the lives of saints. Many of the Pagan works appear as copies
in later collections. The earliest texts are identified by analysing the
style and age of the Irish (Gaeilge) and Latin writing. It is felt that
some of the Pagan texts are reproductions of orally transmitted poems.
Some seem to match the age of the earliest Christian works, ie. about
AD700. Some could well be much older as interior dates link some to 1st
and 4thC AD/CE. The texts, as copies, partial copies or quotes are
contained in collections or source books, written in both Latin and
Irish. The source books tend to contain a mixture of items. A poem or
description of daily life may be found in a book containing mostly
grammar or law. Collections before the 17th C tend to be more trustworthy
as until that time the filid, descendants of Druids in Ireland, still
retained some power. This is a small selection.
Here are some of the source books, the first three are quite im****tant:
Book of the Dun Cow (Lebor na hUide), 12th C ; Book of Leinster (Lebor
Laighneach), before 1160; Yellow Book of Lecan, late 14th C; Book of
Ballymote; Book of Lismore; Book of Armagh; Annals of Ulster; Annals of
Inisfallen; Annals of the Four Masters (An. Rioghachta Eireann), 1632-6.
This first group of texts is mostly law, geography, grammar, etc.:
Dindshenchas (History of Places); Coir Anmann (Fitness of Names);
Leabhar na gCeart (Book of Rights), Brehon law; Senchas Mor, Brehon law;
Coire Goriath (Cauldron of Poesy); Auraicept na nEces, grammar;
Sanas Chormaic (Cormac's Glossary ); Crich Gablach, laws.
This group consists of heroic tales, myths, sacred stories, some of
which may have a historical basis and some are pre-Christian contact:
Audacht Morainn (Morann's Will); Cath Maige Tuired (Second Battle of
Moytura); Tain Bo Cualnge(Cattle Raid of Cooley); Aislinge Oengus(Dream
of Angus); Longas mac n-Usnig (Fate of the Children of Uisneach); Fled
Bricrenn(Bricriu's Feast); Scela Mucce Maic DaTho(The Story of Mac DaTho's
Pig); Lebor Gabala (Book of Invasions); Togail Bruidne Da Derga
(Destruction of Da-Derga's Hostel); Orgain Denna Rig (Destruction of
Dind Rig); Tochmarc Etaine (Wooing of Etain); Tororuigheacht Dhiarmadha
agus Ghrainne (Pursuit of Dermot and Grainia); Accallam na Senorach
(Colloquy of Old Men); Buile Suibhne (Intoxification of Sweeney);
various Imrams eg. Voyage of Bran.
Welsh texts - These are generally later than the Irish texts. They
also are found as copies in larger books. There is, maybe, a greater
problem with later works mixed wtih earlier ones, for instance, many
of the poems of Taliessin aren't pre-twelth century.
-There are annals that cover Wales; Annals of Wales, Annals of Ulster
and histories; by Gildas, Nennius but these aren't all Welsh writers.
-Black Book of Carmarthen, late 12thC
-Black Book of Chirk, 1200, which contains the Venedotian Code, also
called the Laws of King Hywel
-Book of Taliesin, c1275
-White Book of Rhyddech, c1325, contains the Mabinogion which has
eleven parts in four sections. The Mabinogi proper, which has
corelations to some Irish texts: Pwyll, Branwen, Manawydan, Math.
Tales from Roman era Britain: Dream of Macsen Wledic, Lludd and Llevelys.
Authurian tales: Killrwch and Olwen, Dream of Rhonabwy.
Chivalrous tales: Lady of the Fountain, Peredur, Geraint ap Erbin.
-Book of Anerin, c1250, the Gododin
-Red Book of Hergest, 1375 to 1425, also contains the Mabinogion
Somebody is bound to opine that it's better to keep company with trees
than sheets of paper, better to look into the eyes of a calf than to
turn pages of vellum. Of course, it's possible to do both.
17 What are the festivals of the Druids?
In which Celtic culture? Which era? Okay... Generally, current Druids
celebrate similar festival to other neo-pagans: the solar festivals and
the quarter festivals. It seems that the ancient Celts did not celebrate
the Equinoxes or Solstices but they were aware of them. The cross-quarter
or fire festivals are:
*+ Samhain, Celtic New Year ( All Saints) Nov.1st;
Imbolc or Brigid ( Candlemas) Feb.1st;
Bealtaine ( May Day) May 1st;
Lughnasadh or Lunasa ( Lammas ) Aug.1st.
These were usually celebrated on the eve: Oiche Shamhna (All Hallow's
Evening or Hallowe'en); Oiche Bhealtaine (May Eve) etc. Some feel it
is appropriate to celebrate the festivals according to the lunar calendar,
on the full moon.
Whereas the quarter festivals are more im****tant, some current Druids
also observe the solar festivals. There are different reasons. Some
tend to socialise with other neo-pagans and just join in. Others want to
honor the earth; holidays that commemorate the earth's motion seem
appropriate. Another group may want to avoid the Christian holidays of
Christmas and Easter so substitute the winter solstice and spring equinox.
Others are just party animals and will celebrate anything.
* For brevity, the names are given in Irish and English only but there
are Gaidhlig, Welsh, Breton, French, German and maybe Gaulish versions.
+ The ancient Celts lived only in the Northern Hemisphere. Their
descendents in the Southern Hemisphere follow the seasonality of the
festivals and reverse the date, ie. Bealtaine is celebrated Nov.1st.
18 Is Druidism/Druidry a form of: religion, spirituality or philosophy?
Don't ask. If you must, bring your tights, mask and wrestling garb.
- Religion includes spirituality, culture, ritual, myth and philosophy.
It's a rich mix and if you listened to ME, you could learn the Truth.
- Religion is bossy people trying to impose their own views. Spiritual
people are peaceful. Religion is responsible for wars! You Are AN
IDIOT!
- Druidry is a philosophy. We have no need to impose our views like you
distasteful lot. A Druid could be a Christian or a Buddhist...
- Ayeee!!! Christians are the worst, they're killing the planet! EVIL!
- See! You've been corrupted - Evil is a CHRISTIAN concept. Zen Nut!
Etc. etc. etc. Repeat.
19 What are Ogham? Aren't they runes?
Runes are an ancient Nordic/Germanic alphabet, with a symbol for each
letter. Ogham were Celtic. They are more of a code or marking system;
three lines for one letter, four for another. There were carved in
Ireland, Scotland, Wales and Mann, roughly between 200 and 600 AD/CE.
They were carved in stone with short messages in Old Irish, a few in
Latin, usually pertaining to memorials or boundaries. It used to be
assumed that the ogham letters derived from the Roman alphabet but
this no longer finds agreement with all.
Irish texts contain references to counting sticks and memory markers
that may have been Ogham cut on wood. No archaeological examples have
been found. It could be that the wood versions preceded the stone ones
by hundreds of years but we don't know for sure. There are some stray
examples of ogham on texts and on decorative bits of bone.
There are no references in the Nordic Sagas to runes being used for
divination but nowadays they are so used. Similarly there's no clear
cut description of Ogham divination in Celtic texts, but there seem
to be some hints. Ogham are now used by some for divination, inspiration,
spritual guidance etc. It is possible that they were so used by Gaelic
Druids in ancient times. The Tree Alphabet is used to identify the
letters and many long lists of correspondances are possible.
20 What's Imbas? Awen? How about the "Otherworld"?
Imbas is an Old Irish word meaning "poetic inspiration".
Imbas in current english seems to be used to mean: divine inspiration,
spiritual understanding and/or inspired knowledge.
Awen is a more recent, Welsh-derived word meaning roughly the same.
The "Otherworld" could refer to a Druid's belief in reincarnation or
an afterlife but here it refers more to a spiritual understanding or
realm, arrived at perhaps with imbas. It is a concept that is held
by a variety of opposing groups on a.r.d. They do not, of course,
agree on what it means or what to call it. Having an Otherworld
experience could mean: that you have communed with the gods, the elders
or with spirits; that you have become one with the cosmos; that you
understand and can connect with the basic is-ness of existence; etc.
All agree it is something that must be experienced to understand and
that it can't be explained.
21 Are you Druids a bunch of racists?
No. Why would anyone think Druids might be racist?...
In the early 1900s when there many minority nationalist groups in
the old monarchies and empires of Europe agitating for rights, some of
these associated with the Fascists. The Nazis had a minorly pagan flavor
and the Nazis were very racist. The Bretons were, and still are to some
extent, oppressed by the French government. I've read that in the early
1900's some Breton meso-Druids were Fascist. That is the only clear
association I've seen between Druids groups and racism.
The Celtic peoples and the Germanic peoples are neither Latin nor Semitic
nor Slav. Some white supremacists, disfavoring those ethnicities, might
get attracted to neo-pagan groups focusing on Northwestern Europe. Asatru
or Nordic Paganism, more often than Druidism, get accused of racism and
association with pro-Aryan groups. Some years ago I read of one ( 1 )
Asatru group that described itself as "racialist". The Druid groups
don't seem interested in racism possibly because several current Celtic
nations have been on the receiving end of oppression from the British and
French governments.
There are some posters on a.r.d. who are strongly anti-Christian. As
Western society has been strongly Christian, some see that religion
as responsible for all our ills. A few would extend that to any
religion based on the bible: Judaism, Christianity and Islam. Some
are anti-"all established forms of religion". Generally this is on the
level of ideas and not anti-peoples or racist. Most of us are tolerant
of others' religious choices.
- - - - - - -
Well, well, let me update that one. We have had recently, 2007-2008,
at least one self-identified Druid on a.r.d with demonstrable fascist
connections and a tendency to flame. So there has been much talk of
this and throwing of insults. In the ensuing melee, there has also been
little evidence of religious tolerance or tolerance of any sort; with
the exception that a few former foes have discovered each other to be
not quite as disgusting as the new lot.
22 How do current Druids relate to Deity? Who are the Celtic Deities?
The question is never asked as above but there is a lot of concern and
disagreement about God/esses, Deities, the Divine, mysticism, the beyond.
If you pair the above nouns with the verbs: believe, follow, venerate,
revere, wor****p, honor, imagine, etc.; some will consider the terms
roughly synonymous, others will reject certain of these verbs most
vigorously. There is also occasional wrangling over: belief, agnosticism
and aetheism. This makes a potential minefield for the oversensitve
newbie.
Current Celtic pagans generally do not follow the Wiccan tradition
of "a Lord" and "a Lady" that may draw their identity from a variety
of deities. The Celtic sense of deity is more distinct. There were
many gods not just two. Nor do they seem to follow a greek type
pantheon, where each god had a single quality. Celtic deities
seemed more all-purpose and may have belonged to just one tribe.
Among those who make use of historically known Celtic dieties there
is disagreement as to: whether there were many ( any ? ) gods common
to all the Celtic regions; whether the Romans and later the Christians
corrupted the record of Celtic mythology.
Posters to a.r.d. have shown varying degrees of interest in:
- Gods, goddesses, demi-gods etc. ( however conceived )
- Things that might be refered to as a deity but that don't have
anthropomorphic form
- Sacred images or locales such as: the sun, wheels, wells or springs,
groves
- A nameless spirit in ( and/or transcending ) nature
- nature or Nature
- The guidance of spirits or ancestral ghosts
This doesn't seem to divide up tidily i.e. those who are big on
gods may pooh pooh spirits; those who decry gods as terrible lies
may be quite serious about spirits.
One reason for all this variety may be the ancient Celts themselves.
They were spread across a thousand years of time and geographically
across most of Europe. They were polytheisistic but intermingled
peripherally with many other ethnic groups and their religions.
They had religious images of: human figures, giants, animals, spirals,
wheels, trees etc. They had sacred wells, springs, rivers and groves
into which they deposited items which may have been offerings.
>From ancient carved momuments we have the names of many Celtic deities.
Most of these names appear only once. Some them may have been tribal
names and not gods. A few deity names do appear in all the Celtic
regions notably, Lug/Lugh/Llew. Ancient texts containing sacred stories
and heroic tales, include many names. Some names cited in popular
lists of gods may have actually been ancestors or charcters from
heroic tales.
Should you be interested in Celtic deities, you should research the
subject yourself. Here is a list of the names that seem most common,
some of which are special to members of a.r.d. I've listed them by
region, some appear more than once.
Ireland/Gaelic areas:
Boann, Bel, Brigid, Caillech (the Hag),the Dagda, Danu, Diancecht
Goibiu, Lugh, Macha, Manannan MacLir, Medb, Morrigan, Nuadu,
Oengus Og, Ogma
Wales:
Ceridwen, Govannan, Llew, Mabon, Manawyddan, Pryderi, ****d, Rhiannon
Gaul/Continental Europe: ( some British )
Belenus, Brigantes, Cernuunos, Dana, Epona, Esus, Lug, Maponos,
Matronea, Noudans, Ogmios, Sucellos, Taranis, Teutates
And if a Celt thought deity/spirit was too sacred to name, that "name"
couldn't appear here could it?
23 Is Druidry necessarily Celtic?
Most people identify Druids as being Celtic. The question is:
How Celtic should modern Druidry/Neo-druidism be?
- The absolute Celtophiles want Druids to be very familiar with ancient
texts, Celtic folkways and Celtic archaeology. Moreover a Druid should
study a Celtic language and use it in rituals. Druidry, for them,
is inextricably Celtic.
- Others say yes, but seeing as most of us don't live in a Celtic
country and the Celts have moved on since ancient days, some adjusting
is necessary. One should have a good general knowledge of things
Celtic or at least of the particular Celtic nation one specializes in
but language study isn't needed.
- The group ADF has decided, that totally knowing the ancient Celts
would be impossible due to gaps in the record. To try and fill this gap,
they admit all Indo-European sources, seeing these as being closely
related to the Celts. So you occasionally get the oddity of a "Druid"
who follows only the Greek gods. A.r.d. wasn't too welcoming to the
last one who dropped by.
- The last group opines that what is im****tant to Druids is a
personal relation****p with nature and its spirit. Scholar****p isn't
necessary and may be damaging. You are a Druid because you are a
seeker who matches the ethos of the Druids ...whatever that is.
Then there is the proviso, referenced by some of the above, that one
should keep actual modern day Celts in mind. Someone living in a modern
Celtic nation may be concerned with the economics in their homelands,
with their families, with loss of culture and language. They're probably
Christian. A neo-pagan, who's never been in their land or any Celtic
land, claiming to be a Celtic expert might seem insulting.
24 Is is okay to charge money for cl***** on Druidry?
There has been some noise about this topic so I've tried to
research it. Religion and money seems a touchy subject in the world
at large not just with the Druids and neo-pagans.
I had the impression that some neo-pagan groups did have a rules about
money but my query on the pagan groups didn't get any concrete answers.
Some thought a teacher could charge to cover the expenses involved in a
holding class but not charge any sort of wage. Others thought that it
wasn't differant from any other sort of teaching and charging something
to pay for hours worked made sense. Some thought it was okay to charge
for tarot readings but not for spells, etc. All agreed that one can't
buy love or wisdom nor can spirituality be simply conferred in a class.
I asked a celtic academic about it, who couldn't think of any historical
text that would frown on paid teaching. But he pointed out that the
ancient Celts lived in an entirely differant world economically and
socially. Whereas money existed, most coins where held in offering
hordes and not used in everyday exchange. Goods and services were
exchanged mostly by barter. The Celts had status goods such as jewelery
and elaborately decorated weapons, Status was also conferred by owning
large herds of livestock and sometimes by raiding the herds of neighbours.
Religious training was largely passed down in family groups or tribes.
In at least some tribes there was formal training of Druids/religious
leaders which extended beyond the home tribe.
Majority opinion on a.r.d. is that the Celts were materialistic and
practical. They would have no problem with charging for lessons or a
paid clergy. Money is the current method of exchange and it's what
people understand. The Druids were the communication experts of their
day. So it makes sense that modern Druids should use the most efficient
current media such as the internet, even if face to face communications
are the ideal.
Some agree that there is no problem with charging but also observe
that hospitality was very im****tant with the Celts and that a high
status Druid might have provided materially for younger Druids. This
being the case a current Druid teacher or group might feel it appropriate
to donate their time or some expenses if possible. But, as we don't
live in a tribal society where obligations and duties are delineated
by tradition, sacrifices by the teacher may not even be noticed. We
can all think of instances where a teacher/student relation****p became
exploitive or resented on one or both sides. All in all a respect for
the path and learning is considered more im****tant than the question
of fees.
A minority opinion follows the family/tribal model figuring that all
teaching must be face to face, free of charge and that, in a
relation****p of respect, expenses would never be a problem. There is
a perceived prohibition on paying for cl***** or anything related to
spirituality. Internet or mail-order cl***** are thought to be a
waste of time.
My advice is simply: buyer beware. Whether you "pay" with money, time or
devotion, use some discernment as there's lot of junk out there.
25 I've just become a member! Where's the moderator?
No, you most certainly have not. Alt.religion.druid is a newsgroup.
Newsgroups do not have members. Pray, do a search on "Usenet" or
"newsgroup" and find out what it is. In brief, the Usenet is an
older computer medium, it is not a list nor a room nor a blog. People
access it in differant ways, which may use terminology or statistics
that do not apply to the whole Usenet. Some get newsgroups from
their ISP and use a newsreader. Others access it via html on archives
such as Google. The Usenet does not belong to Google or to any other
organisation. Google or a similar organisation may agree to send a
newsgroup to your e-mailbox and it may identify this as "joining" or
"enrolling" but, on the newsgroups themselves, this has no status. The
only status possible on an unmoderated newsgroup is that of a poster.
You become a poster by posting messages. If you simply read messages,
you can consider yourself a lurker ( but no one else will know ).
Alt.religion.druid was formed as an unmoderated group. It can't be
changed. There is no moderator. No one can be thrown off the group.
No messages can be blocked. It is totally uncensored. If a poster
is behaving poorly, the other posters can do nothing about it, other
than by observing netiquette. Example: Most flamers thrive on attention,
if ignored they may eventually go elsewhere. And, if you killfile or
don't read, the posts of poorly behaved posters ( flamers, trollers,
spammers etc.) you may find the remaining few posts worthy.
26 What IS in the alt.religion.druid charter?
"Alt.religion.druid exists as a forum for discussion of the mysticism,
history, archaeology and literature of the druids ( often related to the
Celtic peoples of northern European history: the Britons or Gauls and
their religious or shamanic social elite). While there is some debate as
to the historical survival of druids or information concerning them, the
newsgroup will include all manner of speculation regarding the practice
and theory surrounding druids of ancient and modern times.
As with the creation of alt.religion.wicca and alt.religion.asatru,
alt.religion.druid shall provide a forum for discussion not already
covered by existing newsgroups. Related newsgroups like
soc.culture.celtic, alt.mythology and alt.pagan may well include
druidic spirituality as a part of its charter, but not exclusively so.
Also, alt.religion.druid shall provide a hierarchy for newsgroups
associated with particular druid organizations to subclass from in the
future should the need arise ( e.g. a.r.d.adf or a.r.d.keltria )"
27 Netiquette - very briefly, please:
1 Be polite. Be thoughtful. Spirituality and ethnicity are
sensitive issues and you know nothing about the person you address.
2 Don't re-post an entire, long message. Include only the part you
are replying to, snip the rest.
3 Keep your line lengths to 70-80 spaces.
4 If you enter a thread in mid-stream, check out the beginning
on http://groups.google.com
or just be very careful. It can be very
difficult to tell who wrote what.
5 If you must cross-post, limit it to three groups related to the
topic.
6 Post no response to obnoxious, off-topic, multi-cross-posted threads.
They can entirely jam a smaller newsgroup. E-mail a reply, if you
must.
7 If you really need to have a protracted and boring fight with your
arch-enemy, take it to e-mail. It's off-topic and We Don't Care!
8 Newsgroups are public, anyone can read them. Therefore post nothing
you wouldn't want your current boss, future boss, etc. to see.
9 Check out:
http://www.usenetservices.com/
see FAQ
http://www.dtcc.edu/cs/rfc1855.html
see 3.1 NetNews
http://www.searchlores.org/trolls.htm
http://welcome.twysted.net/
If you need more information on anything:
research it yourself;
read a.r.d;
post a question to a.r.d.
In the meantime, and everyday, think of the Earth in all you do.
Elaine cu072@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
:-)
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