<lsenders@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> escribió en el mensaje
news:F1181942-D309-630A-8738-E17C758DBAF3@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On Dec 5, 1:19 pm, "Miguel" <responderalgr...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>>
>> But do you have some biblical text that explain that the salvation is
by
>> "faith alone"?
>>
>> Because according to the verses that I exposed in the previous message,
>> clearly the Baptism of Water coincides with the Baptism of the Spirit.
>>
> Here's the dilemma. If water baptism is the source of regeneration
> and if
> Christ stated that one cannot see the Kingdom _unless_ they first be
> "born from above" then how can they enter into the water apart from
> the
> mentality of works?
I think that the source of regeneration is the work of Christ in the
cross,
and the Baptism is the identification with Christ in His death, and
resurrection, but being also according to the Bible, the sign before God,
of
to have died and resurrected as Christ, that is to say, the baptized
begins
a new life as if to have been born again.
So by our baptism into his death we were buried with him, so that as
Christ
was raised from the dead by the Father's glorious power, we too should
begin
living a new life.
If we have been joined to him by dying a death like his, so we shall be by
a
resurrection like his;
realising that our former self was crucified with him, so that the self
which belonged to sin should be destroyed and we should be freed from the
slavery of sin.
(Romans 6:4-6, New Jerusalem Bible)
> It would have to be of the flesh because one
> cannot
> operate after the Spirit until after regeneration. Theologically, it
> is illogical
> and biblically it unwarranted. For every verse that you note where
> salvation
> and water baptism are in the context, I can give one, if not two (how
> about
> the OT?) where water baptism is nowhere chronologically connected.
> Rathe
> it is connected as an after evidentiary of identification. John's
> baptism
> wasn't about salvation. It was about identification. And what was
> cir***cision? It was an outward manifestation of being identified with
> the
> covenant God made with the nation Israel. As Paul teaches in Romans,
> it had no salvific merit whatsoever.
But the Christian Baptism has the aggregate that there is given the Holy
Spirit, that is to say, also the Baptism of the Spirit.
'You must repent,' Peter answered, 'and every one of you must be baptised
in
the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will
receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
(Acts 238, New Jerusalem Bible)
> Consider this. If water baptism was a prerequisite to effectual
> salvation, then why is that doctrine not clearly taught.
But the doctrine was clearly taught
>Rather what
> is
> clearly taught is that one must "believe and ye shall be saved." And
> "belief" is defined in the NT as being more than just knowledge of and
> intellectual ascent.
I read in the Bible the believe is understood like receive the Baptism
When he asked, 'Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you became
believers?'
they answered, 'No, we were never even told there was such a thing as a
Holy
Spirit.'
He asked, 'Then how were you baptised?' They replied, 'With John's
baptism.'
(Acts 19:2-3, New Jerusalem Bible)
> For if all you have are those two then it only
> qualifies you to be a demon.
When by curiosity I read texts of pentecostal persons, several times I see
that they are doing the mention about demons, something similar to those
persons of the New Age when constantly they mention to the
extraterrestrials.
>> I think that, when someone is explaining a fundamental christian
doctrine
>> without a biblical base, that only is human philosophy.
>>
> I think you've never read a theology book that expounds on the
> subject, especially a biblically oriented theological work.
> Lutherans
> and all others who teach baptismal regeneration, are logically
> shut up to the view that all who die unbaptized are lost. How is
> this different that the RC view that salvation is only from with
> in it?
Sincerely I think that in your case, It is needed to be a Roman Catholic
to
understand really this.
However, God's solid foundation-stone stands firm, and this is the seal on
it: 'The Lord knows those who are his own' and 'All who call on the name
of
the Lord must avoid evil.'
(2 Timothy 2:19, New Jerusalem Bible)
--
Miguel M. Yalán
http://mmyv.com
((( s.r.c.b-s is a moderated group. All posts are approved by a
moderator. )))
((( Read http://srcbs.org
for details about this group BEFORE you post.
)))
|
