Don Atkinson wrote:
> As a life long atheist I'll do my best to answer your questions.
>
> Firstly if your faith determines what you do in life then why have so
many
> catholics I know had anal sex and I have not? Take it on faith that I am
> sexually attractive and would appreciate such activity as much as I'm
sure
> they have. My point is this. I have never broken the law and many
religious
> people have. I havent thrown my genitals all over the place so much as
they
> have. I think faith is only a guide in your life if you make it one. My
> morality is my guide to being moral.I've never had faith. Some faithful
> folks just happen to be faithful but let their stomach, wallet, and
> biological urges do the thinking. If faith insures morality, it insures
is
> about as effectively as hurricane insurance from a company which just
filed
> bankruptcy. It only gave insurance in theory, not in practice. If having
> morals without religion is not possible than I am all the proof of
miracles
> you should ever need.
>
But , if there is no god , what is wrong with having ones genitalia
waved all over the place ?
who decides what is moral and immoral anyway , what are you using for a
yardstick here ?
> How you feel before you die? If religion is a mechanism for dealing with
a
> fear of death it is a poor one in any form except for Islam. Muslims who
> detonate their belt-bombs are very confident of their afterlife. I have
seen
> christians who in thier last moments on earth were supremely failed by
thier
> mechanism for dealing with death and cried and screamed until they
expired.
> They didnt see death as a new beginning like they were supposed to. I
> realized on a helicopter in Afghanistan that when it landed I would be
> someplace where i might die. I took faith in my training and my fellow
> soldiers and accepted that if they werent enough I could die and that
would
> be it. I freed myself from my fear of death when I was 20. If I scream
when
> I'm dying it will be because I have soemthing left to say before I go.
>
I dont know that religion is meant to be a mechanism to deal with death
, the only time I personally heard it described as such is from athiests
.
> Does atheism provide answers about love, death, hope etc? Well lets see
what
> secular works deal with such contemplations. Shakespeare, Nietzche,
> Aristotle, Leucippus, Democritus, and just go to your library and see
the
> rest for yourself. Alot of people have written ideas about moral
judegement
> and general common life problems from a standpoint other than claiming
to be
> the word of god. The bible is one book, the Koran another, there are
many
> hundreds of thousands of other texts which deal with life. The bible is
only
> more popular because nobody ever formed a military for the purpose of
> forcing everyone to accept Shakespeare. The Greek sophists were writing
> about life many years before Jesus. Its not surprising that given todays
> lack of interest in reading that someone might overlook this. Perhaps I
have
> found a better reason than atheism for the decline of america.
Illiteracy.
>
> Now for my final point about the serial killers etc. I will take the
> Virginia Tech shooter as an example. By the way I ran this past a sunday
> school teacher and she said she'd have to trust my math but my conept of
> forgiveness is correct.
>
> The V-tech shooter kills 33 and also himself, but lets suppose instead
he is
> caught and imprisoned for life or some odd decades before getting the
chair.
>
> 33 lives which were cut short by 50 years (god only knows but lets use
it as
> an example) so he ends 1650 years of life.
> He causes 5 years of anguish to the 5 closest survivores of each victim.
(5
> years spread out over a lifetime of missing them)
> 33*5*5= 825 years.
>
> So for 2,475 years of pain or death that he caused he goes to hell?? for
an
> eternity?? Lets say an eternity is 1,000,000 years.
>
> He would suffer in hell for 400 times the amount of suffering that he
> caused. For those not mathematically inclined there are alot of millions
in
> an eternity. In other words, you cannot cause unending amounts of pain
in a
> mortal life which has an end. You can only have unending pain in the
> afterlife. By being forgiven before you die you can get away with
anything
> mortal which you did because the mortal life has no fraction next to
> eternity. Ten Thousand Years is the same as Twenty when you are
comparing
> them to eternity. So it is fair that anyone can be forgiven? Yes, its
fair
> that you should be forgiven for what you did in teh fleeting blink of an
eye
> that is your mortal life.
>
You lack a serious comprehension of the subject of forgiveness as in the
scriptures .
> So which makes you feel better about yourself? Which makes you feel more
> justice? That Hitler is in the same unending Hell as a child born out of
> wedlock? Or that its all just make beleive? Is it so appealing that
Hitler
> is in hell because he commited suicide instead of asking to be forgiven
and
> dying from some other cause? and that some 14 year old kid with severe
> depression kills himself having not first killed 6 million other people
and
> goes to hell as well for his suicide?
>
which hell tho are you speaking of ? The pope has written hell off as
church policy now , also purgatory I believe I think they are leaving
the dead now as they are described in the bible
Ecclesiastes 9:5
For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing;
they have no further reward, and even the memory of them is forgotten.
> Is it fair that anyone can be forgiven when a murderer can be forgiven
after
> killing someone who didnt have the chance to be forgiven? the murderer
goes
> to heaven and the victim to hell? Fair?
>
> If you beleive that people are in hell forever for soem sex they had
that
> was considered cheating or because they didnt love their parents or they
> stole something because they coveted it,, and because of these minor
> offenses (made infinitely more minor with each passing second by the
> infinitely and majorly unjust Hell) Then I maintain that you need to
find
> your way to atheism, Because compared to you, I am saved.
>
why the hell would an atheist worry about being saved ? What from ?
> Never mistake someone's insistence on being irrational and superstitious
as
> morality.
>
that last sentence is very good advice .
> "Mariachi" <jpgarcia153@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
>
news:07df5f0d-7bc4-4d0d-a7ff-1f515ac67363@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>> Christopher, like all atheists, knows that there is no "pupose of
>>> life" other than the purpose we create for ourselves. And you know
>>> what? That works out just fine for us. We don't need some
>>> nonexistent supernatural being to give our lives "meaning" or
>>> "purpose."
>> Everybody is responsible for their actions or beliefs whether they
>> realize it or not. Your faith (whether it be atheism, Muslim,
>> Christianity, Hinduism, etc...) determines what you do in life, and
>> ultimately the way you feel before you die. Does atheism provide
>> definite answers about moral judgment, the afterlife, death, passed
>> away relatives, hope, and love? Do you really think that we will not
>> be judged on how we live our life in this world?
>>
>> You are saying that all the corrupt politicians, Hitler, serial
>> killers, and thieves will not be judged for their actions because you
>> believe there is no ultimate judge, no God. Atheism provides very
>> little answers concerning these topics.
>
>
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