"Raymond" <rwknapp@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:0ccf9eec-d858-4f6c-a14c-473e7b38f97e@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
May 9, 11:29 am, "SongBookz" <songbo...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> "Raymond" <rwkn...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
>
>
news:f46294cc-284b-4647-96c9-ff42cd245f24@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On May 8, 2:34 am, 2...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(•R. L. Measures) wrote:
> > > Your reply is total idiocies. I sure there were many thousands of
> > > gods people followed many had sacrifice blood based and so on.
>
> > ** agreed
>
> > >Which
> > > has nothing to do with Jesus or a pagan Sun-God play of words it is
> > > SON of GOD not SUN.
>
> > ** Mithra was the Persian sun God.
>
> > >Jesus came to set such silly teachings like
> > > yours to rest and make the way for mankind to find the real GOD! Dec
> > > 25, was not and could not be the birthday of Jesus
>
> > ** Agreed
>
> > > it was only a day
> > > that was picked out of 360 days, no matter what day one picked
people
> > > like you would find some reason to mock it.
>
> > ** Picking the birthday of the sun God Mithra was not a good choice
> > since
> > Jesus of Nazareth was likely born in October.
>
> If you lived at that time it was the best day to pick, as it was
> really three days and the people were drunk that did wor****p Mithra
> and so no one cared what Christians were doing as they were to far
> gone. Remember followers of Jesus were no permited to wor****p and
> this would be the best time to do that. Then just because some other
> god or thing was done by some other group does not mean they are doing
> the same. I can go to church at the same time a group are in a bar
> getting drunk, everyone knows church and bar have nothing to do with
> each othere. It really does not matter what month Jesus was born,
> what does matter is he was born. One day is just as good as any
> othere.
I am not sure what program you are using as the above is what I said,
and below is not, but there is no way to see that here.
Terrell: My program somehow turned off adding >'s to replies - trying to
figure out how to turn it back on.
>
> By the time they decided to celebrate Christ's Mass to discourage people
> from celebrating the "birthday of the sun," Christians were not being
> persecuted but had become the state religion. Later pagan customs were
> incor****ated into it (trees, yule log, etc.) Even in America, the
Puritans
> didn't celebrate Christmas and hardly anyone did in America for a long
> time.
There was no such celebrating of any sun by christians. The became
the State religon later on, and when they picked the 25 they were
being persecuted State untill the ruler had a vision. History shows
that time table. Then I do not recall ever reading about America not
celebrating Christmas.
Terrell: http://www.thehistoryofchristmas.com/ch/in_america.htm
From: http://www.didyouknow.cd/xmas/xma****story.htm
"In the year 274AD, solstice fell on 25th December. Roman Emperor Aurelian
proclaimed the date as "Natalis Solis Invicti," the festival of the birth
of
the invincible sun. In 320 AD, Pope Julius I specified the 25th of
December
as the official date of the birth of Jesus Christ.
"In 325AD, Constantine the Great, the first Christian Roman emperor,
introduced Christmas as an immovable feast on 25 December. He also
introduced Sunday as a holy day in a new 7-day week, and introduced
movable
feasts (Easter). In 354AD, Bishop Liberius of Rome officially ordered his
members to celebrate the birth of Jesus on 25 December.
"However, even though Constantine officiated 25 December as the birthday
of
Christ, Christians, recognising the date as a pagan festival, did not
share
in the emperor's good meaning. Christmas failed to gain universal
recognition among Christians until quite recently. In England, Oliver
Cromwell banned Christmas festivities between 1649 and 1660 through the
so-called Blue Laws, believing that Christmas should be a solemn day."
>
> Christianity has borrowed lots of pagan symbols over the centuries. The
> little"t" cross which was the "Mystic Tau" a symbol of Tammuz and can be
> traced back centuries before that. Steeples adapted from the Egyptian
> Obelisk which was part of sun wor****p. The Trinity - practically all
pagan
> deities were part of a trinity. and so on...
More like Catholics not Christians did such.
> > >Christianity never
> > > adopted any God Mithra's or what ever name one wants to use.
>
> > ** History says they did.
>
> No it does not! You will not find in any true Christian church or
> history any word of wor****p of Mithra's as their God.
>
> Of course not, but in many cases, Christians have just changed Mithra's
> name
> to Jesus.
Never happen!
> > >You seem
> > > to forget it was God that made all days and pagans just used them.
So
> > > when a Christian takes back the day, you all try to make it sound
like
> > > the pagan owned it. Sorry that ideal does not hold water. God made
> > > the days long before any pagan lived. You also don't seem to know
> > > much about true history or the teachings of the Jew that is real and
> > > theirs not some book of pagan teachings that you seem to follow or
> > > want others to believe which are just lies and falsehoods.
>
> > ** paganization of Christianity did not come until 3-centuries after
the
> > curcifixtion.
>
> I can agree with some of that, only Paul did say even in his day that
> false teachers were already preaching falsehoods.
>
> If you have access to Vine's Expository Dictionary, there's a good
article
> on this under "Cross."
I have access, so what?
Terrell: the article for the word "cross" has a good article on how pagan
customs got incor****ated into Christianity:
A-1 Noun Strong's Number: 4716 Greek: stauros
denotes, primarily, "an upright pale or stake." On such malefactors were
nailed for execution. Both the noun and the verb stauroo, "to fasten to a
stake or pale," are originally to be distinguished from the ecclesiastical
form of a two beamed "cross." The shape of the latter had its origin in
ancient Chaldea, and was used as the symbol of the god Tammuz (being in
the
shape of the mystic Tau, the initial of his name) in that country and in
adjacent lands, including Egypt. By the middle of the 3rd cent. A.D. the
churches had either departed from, or had travestied, certain doctrines of
the Christian faith. In order to increase the prestige of the apostate
ecclesiastical system pagans were received into the churches apart from
regeneration by faith, and were permitted largely to retain their pagan
signs and symbols. Hence the Tau or T, in its most frequent form, with the
cross-piece lowered, was adopted to stand for the "cross" of Christ. As
for
the Chi, or X, which Constantine declared he had seen in a vision leading
him to champion the Christian faith, that letter was the initial of the
word
"Christ" and had nothing to do with "the Cross" (for xulon, "a timber
beam,
a tree," as used for the stauros, see under TREE). The method of execution
was borrowed by the Greeks and Romans from the Phoenicians. The stauros
denotes (a) "the cross, or stake itself," e.g., Mat 27:32; (b) "the
crucifixion suffered," e.g., 1Cr 1:17,18, where "the word of the cross,"
RV,
stands for the Gospel; Gal 5:11, where crucifixion is metaphorically used
of
the renunciation of the world, that characterizes the true Christian life;
Gal 6:12,14; Eph 2:16; Phl 3:18. The judicial custom by which the
condemned
person carried his stake to the place of execution, was applied by the
Lord
to those sufferings by which His faithful followers were to express their
fellow****p with Him, e.g., Mat 10:38.
Terrell
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