On Fri, 02 May 2008 02:14:22 -0700, arah wrote:
> No holy Trinity!
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> Christian belief about holy Trinity:
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> *Father is a God, Son is a God, and Holy Ghost is a God; but there are
> not three Gods, only one God! (Christians do not seem to know simple
> math, although they are expert in science and technology!)
>
You have too many articles in that paragraph. Allow me to rewrite it how
Christians say this:
"The Father is God, The Son is God and the Holy Spirit is God; There is
one god expressed in three persons!"
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> *Father is an Almighty, Son is an Almighty, and Holy Ghost is an
> Almighty; but there are not three Almighty, only one Almighty!
> (Christians seem to be weak in logic and rationality. Because three
> Almighty cannot co-exist together unless they talk about some kind of
> weak and limited almighty!)
Ths one doesn't make sense to me. God is not "an Almighty". He is
"Almighty God". Almighty is an adjective describing God.
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>
>
> *Father is a Person, Son is a Person, and Holy Ghost is a Person; but
> there are not three Persons, only one Person! (Once again Christians do
> not seem to know simple math! Or, maybe, they ha three gods in their
> heart but they feel shy to say it in public because of the vitality and
> logical superiority of Monotheism! They simply lie or deceive themselves
> when they say they believe in one God!)
>
Again, we do not believe in three gods. We believe in one holy God that
is infinite that created us as finite beings, but loves us so much He
came down in the person of the Son to experience our lives as we do and
to provide a new convenant between Him and us.
> Now, the first and foremost point is that Jesus never preached the so-
> called holy Trinity.
Sure He did.
First, Jesus said, "I and the Father are one" in John 10:30. The Jews
even took up stones to stone him and Jesus asked them in v32 why they
want to stone him. They explicitely told him that they wanted to stone
him for blasphemy; for making himself God. So, Jesus definitely knew what
he was saying. There is no "oh wow. I'm sorry. I didn't mean it like
that" after that. He continued with his position that he is God.
Second, Jesus said, "Most certainly, I tell you, before Abraham came into
existence, I AM" (John 8:58). Now, how can a mere man or a prophet pre-
exist Abraham? Abraham died thousands of years for Jesus was born. And
how can anyone claim to be "I AM", a name that Jesus used to definitively
say that He is God Almighty. It is notable that again, they wanted to
stone him. It is not recorded in this instance, but there is no doubt
that they were to stone him for Blasphemy.
>Neither did Abraham and Moses et al. preach anything like that.
Given that Jesus' birth comes after, I'm not at all surprised if they
didn't. God revealed His word over time, not all at once. Why? I have no
idea, but he does have a plan and it's way more intricate than I could
ever hope to understand.
>The word 'trinity' doesn't even exist in the entire Bible!
Neither does the word "Bible". What's your point? The Bible isn't a
dictionary, it is a collection of holy scriptures designed to teach us
who God is and how we may come by salvation through Jesus Christ.
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> Secondly, from logical and rational viewpoint, the so-called holy
> Trinity cannot be existed in reality. Because it doesn't make any sense
> at all as it's a logical impossibility!
>
Really? You would put our limited, finite understanding into an infinite,
unlimited god? Some things are outside of our capability to understand,
but that does not mean they are illogical.
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> That's the reason Quran has strongly rejected the doctrine of Trinity.
> Because it has nothing to do with the teaching of Jesus on one hand and
> it's also an absurdity on the other. Therefore, Muslims do not wonder at
> all when they see educated, intelligence and rational minded Christians
> leaving Christianity in droves!
>
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> Islamic solution of holy Trinity:
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> Father = God the Creator;
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> Son (Jesus) = Prophet of God [Matthew 21:11 , Luke 24:19];
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> Holy Ghost = Arch Angel Gabriel.
>
By denying the Son's place in creation, you contravene John 1:1: In the
beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
(The Word is another title for Jesus)
By denying the Holy Spirit's place in the Trinity you contravene Jesus'
promise that the Comforter will be with the Christian and dwell within
the Christian. Does that mean that every Christian is posessed by the
same angel (I should note that Angels are finite beings, unlike God)? Not
likely. More likely is that God's Spirit - the Holy Spirit - dwells
within.
>
> Does the Islamic solution sound logical and rational?
Not when it is compared to Holy Scripture.
> Each and everybody
> are supposed to agree with this solution unless someone is deaf, dumb
> and blind!
Then I guess I'm deaf, dumb and blind. I'd rather God dwell within me,
speaking to me, showing me his will and speaking through me for His glory
than to have all my faculties and be condemned to eternal damnation.
> That's why majority of reverts to Islam are from Christian
> background.
Many Christians have been failed by their churches. They are looking for
the Truth, but instead find religion. When you find a Christian that is
truly "Born Again", they have as their voice the Holy Spirit which
teaches and guides them to truth, not to lies. Jesus is The Truth. Islam
is a lie.
>
> ------------ --------- -------
> "The future religion of the educated, cultured and enlightened people
> will be Islam."
> - - George Bernard Shaw
With respect to Shaw, he's wrong.
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